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new to KE30 need help starting


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so i just recently acquired a 75 corolla automatic deluxe. Car hasn't been moved or started since 95, when original owner passed away. so far got a new starter and ignition coil. Starter was seized and coil didn't measure within specs. now for the issues, i can't get it to crank by turning the key i have to give power to the signal wire up by the battery, thinking that might be a issue with the no spark as well. any help or suggestions is greatly appreciated would like to hear this car run after sitting for 22yrs now. thanks in advanced for any help   

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Hi Omar,

              Welcome aboard !  In which country are you located ?  I note your car is LH drive.

 

The problem will be quite simple, as there is no power to the ignition coil & also no power to engage the starter.

The problem will be either the ignition fuse, the ignition barrel itself, one of the electrical plugs & sockets at the base of the steering column, or possibly the transmission switch in the centre console, that only lets you start the car, when it is in neutral.

A  test lamp should be able to determine the issue quickly.  I'm putting my money on the transmission switch.

I would temporary run a wire from the battery positive, to the +ve terminal on the coil, and then touch a +ve voltage to the starter circuit as you have described, & see if the car starts.

Off course, all other things like fuel in the carby, fuel in the tank, new oil in the sump, & water in the cooling system, must be right first.

Take off the air filter & squirt some "Sure/Quick Start" pressure can stuff, down the carby throat before trying to start it. 22 years is a long time to sit idle, & lots of things will have become stiff & stuck.  A better idea, would be to remove all spark plugs, squirt some engine oil down the cylinders, & turn the engine over with the starter a few times to loosen things up.

At the same time, disconnect the fuel line into the carby, & check that fuel is being delivered whilst turning the engine over.  This will prove the fuel pump is working & that there is fuel in the tank & lines.  Also change the fuel filter prior to this, as the paper filter would have broken down & blocked. 

I actually started a 5K engine at the weekend, that had been sitting idle out-doors for 12 years. It took 30 minutes to do the above suggestions, & it started first kick.  I couldn't believe it.

If it starts, but runs very rough, or won't idle, I would suspect the carby.  Either remove & thoroughly clean & reassemble, or maybe you could get away with just removing the top, & giving it a real good spray of a carby & throttle cleaner.

Let us know how you go.

You certainly have a lovely little Rolla there.  How many klms/miles, does it show on the odometer/speedo ?

Cheers Banjo

Edited by Banjo
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The neutral switch is under the center console, by the auto gearlever.

Quote

i can't get it to crank by turning the key i have to give power to the signal wire up by the battery,

Which signal wire up by the battery?  Do you have a wiring diagram you can label it on for us?

Check the wire that activates the starter solenoid. Do you get 12V at the starter when you turn the key to start?

Check the coil +ve, do you get 12V with the key "on" and do you still get power there with the key on "start".

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I'm sorry but this new forum is driving me f u c king mad!!  I've written out a long reply twice but it locks up on putting in a link and I can't be f u c k ed wasting my life explaining it all again! irokin this new format is not working!

Just see if you have 12V on the points arm with the battery +ve hooked up to the coil +ve and the points open.

Edited by altezzaclub
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On 6/26/2017 at 5:10 PM, altezzaclub said:

The neutral switch is under the center console, by the auto gearlever.

Which signal wire up by the battery?  Do you have a wiring diagram you can label it on for us?

Check the wire that activates the starter solenoid. Do you get 12V at the starter when you turn the key to start? 

I don't get power to the starter when I crank it.  I don't have a wiring diagram.  

On 6/26/2017 at 5:10 PM, altezzaclub said:

Check the coil +ve, do you get 12V with the key "on" and do you still get power there with the key on "start".

 

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It looks like those two wires supply the illumination bulb under the cover.  So if you don't have a switch there, what stops a KE30 being started in "drive"??  There must be a cutout on the gearbox under the floor.

Here is the KE70 setup. The switch outlined in blue is the auto gear-lever lockout, the dotted line by-passing it is the manual circuit. The auto has a relay to carry the current, so starter solenoid power (green dots) goes from one of the battery fusible links through the starter relay and off to the solenoid. The relay control (blue dots) is via the ignition 'ST' position on the key and the neutral switch. That is a black & white wire leaving the ignition key setup.

I don't know if a KE30 has a ballast resistor, it might have been too early. The KE70s run a 9V coil & a resistor.  On the diagram you can see the ignition power at the key from ST for starting and also IG for running. The blue dots for starting by-pass the ballast resistor to feed power directly into the coil, whereas when you let the ignition key back to the 'run' position the power goes through the ballast to reduce it to 9V to suit the coil. They are a red wire for starting and a black-orange for run. You might only have one.

You could pull the wire junction apart at the ignition key barrel and feed 12V into the white wire going in. Then check what coloured wire does what as it comes back out. If you have a black/white, see if it goes live when you turn to 'start'. If there is a red, see if it goes live for 'ignition'. That would eliminate problems in the key barrel.

Either way, if the points are open and the key is on, you should get a voltage at the points arm.  If you do, then you just jump 12V into the starter solenoid wire to crank it and see if it runs. Then chase the wiring problem.

The solenoid cutout problem means lying under the car and finding that switch.

If you want this wiring diagram it is here-

https://www.dropbox.com/s/s0xs2udvrv9qfl2/downloadfile.jpg?dl=0

It might not be a KE30 one, but its better then nothing.

 

 

Ign starting KE70.jpg

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I went looking for an auto shifter I knew I had in the shed somewhere, that I removed from my KE30 when I did a manual changeover.  Altezzaclub's wiring diagram is how all auto Corollas were wired, with maybe small variations, or maybe different coloured wires.  I can't imagine that Toyota produced some autos with the neutral lock-out switch not incorporated into the auto shifter.  Your photos don't show the area under the plastic ware, where the switch is located.  You can clearly see the switch in the pictures below.  This switch is a combination switch.  It does two functions.  1. It has a N.O switch that only closes when the shifter is in neutral. This allows the starter relay to energise, only when in neutral.  This is as per Altezzaclubs diagram above. 2.  The second function of the combo switch is a N.O. switch which only closes when in reverse.  This turns the reversing lights on.

I just buzzed these out with the shifter I have here.

So there are a total of 6 wires, coming out of the auto shifter.  4 off those are in a plug, and the other two are single wires.

The plug contains the wires for the reversing & Neutral lockout switching.

Plug:   Red wire with White stripe & Red wire with Blue stripe are the reversing switch.

            Black Wire & Black Wire with White Stripe are the neutral lock-out switch.

The two loose wires . . . .  White wire with Black Stripe, & Red wire with Black Stripe are the illumination light, for the auto console, as Altezzaclub pointed out above.

From the photo, you can see that the plug lead is only 9 - 10 cm long, so the matching socket must be close somewhere behind the console. I know that's where I found mine, and just added a shorting link between the Black & Black with White stripe socket terminals.

DSC00001.thumb.JPG.f9cf3e83227018c01a42929d9df8ccff.JPG 

 

DSC00002.thumb.JPG.0382c961605c54539d5a3d47f397a418.JPG

 

DSC00003.thumb.JPG.551c1215681f061ec399156c39180d68.JPG

P.S.  From memory, when I drove a few of these olde auto Corollas, the position of the auto shifter in neutral was quite critical, and you had to jiggle it a bit sometimes to get it to allow the starter circuit to work.  While holding the key in the hard clockwise start position, jiggle the auto shifter that is in neutral & see if that has any effect.

Trust this assists 

Cheers Banjo

Edited by Banjo
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altezza, you will be glad to know i have had enough of that exact forum issue on many many forums, and I'm working on a little chrome plugin for forums, which makes sure u never loose long replies!!
I was once so angry when that happened, i snapped my keyboard in half.

you go to all the trouble of structuring a well thought out reply, editing ad making it understandable and then bang.
 

Edited by rebuilder86
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Hi Jeremy,

                I can believe you would break a key board in half, when you are angry.

Just look what your Avatar indicates you did to your Rolla, when you couldn't get the bonnet open one day !

"In computing, an avatar is the graphical representation of the user or the user's alter ego or character. An icon or figure representing a particular person in a video game, or an Internet forum. "

Cheers Banjo

 

 

   

Edited by Banjo
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