Thought I was screwed (or maybe I still am). 2 questions

[oldpops]

I'll try to be brief:

Q#1) I'm a disabled senior with a balance problem (I can't stand long and I fall a lot). Anyway, we have a 1995 Corolla (base model, 1.6L, automatic transmission, 172,000 miles). It was my birthday, It was 105+ outside, and I had a coupon for a full synthetic oil change for $19.95, and the tire and lube place had just changed my wife's car oil without any problems. So I had them change the oil, and because it was sooo hot outside, I didn't check the oil level on the engine oil dipstick before leaving. The car drove home great - no issues (14 miles).

Got home & parked the car, where it sat for 2 days. Needed the car and it wouldn't start (crank only and backfire coming out from the air filter box??). Checked the oil level and found that it was way over-filled! Used a fluid extractor and took out about 5 liters/about 5-1/2 quarts from an engine that only takes 3.2. quarts. We put in the correct amount of oil and got the car to start (by holding the gas pedal down while cranking - after a few more back-fires) Ran fine again for a few days. car sat again for a few days and when we went to drive it - again, crank/no start. 

The backfire is telling me it's a timing issue (curious how this only started after the over oil change), not related to the oil change mistake. Pulled the plugs and they were fouled. Put in new ones and again got the car to start - again after some backfires through the air filter box & by holding the gas pedal down while cranking. Never detected any foam on the oil dipstick or oil filler cap, nor any smoke from the exhaust. All I know is that the car has always started and run great until the oil change. Am I missing something? The car runs great, once we get it started & I'm thinking the starting issue is a timing issue (the backfires indicate this to me).

Q#2) What are all the different size light bulbs on the instrument cluster? I know that the main 3 bulbs are #194 bulbs, but I don't know about the rest of the bulbs, and my old eyes can't  see any identifying bulb number. Is there any way to make all the bulbs on the instrument cluster illuminate at one time? This would be helpful in knowing which ones are out before changing them.

Any and all help is appreciated!

[altezzaclub]

It doesn't sound like something an oil change would cause, but then again I can't see why the timing would change either. All you can do is check the points gap & timing and see how it goes. Maybe a lot of extra oil would cause heavy breathing through the tappet cover and into the air cleaner to cause black plugs, but cleaning them up should cure that now you've dropped the oil level.

If I was keen enough I'd fix the bulbs that are out in my own instrument cluster, but I have to pull the dash apart in a KE70 and its a frightful job. You're on your own there!

[altezzaclub]

Thinking about it today, is it flooding into the carb making it hard to start and running rich? Did they change a fuel filter? A bit of dirt under the needle and seat, something to chase after checking the ignition stuff.

[oldpops]

Thanks! I'm guessing that the over-fill on the oil change is not causing the backfire & crank/no start issue. It's just strange to me that it started right when the oil change was done. My dear departed mother would tell me it was GOD looking out for me - that he gave the car the crank/no start issue so that I couldn't drive the car around with the extra amount of oil & cause serious damage to the engine! It was always hard for me to argue with my mom when she would come up with something like that. It is a 29 year old car so it's bound to have problems. I don't think this model has any carburetor and the ignition module in the distributor eliminates the points. However, sometimes the spark can jump inside the distributor cap from one point to another. I'll let you know. The tire and lube place said they would do a timing check, and look inside the distributor cap & check the rotor - hopefully they will let me look at what they find, although I'm probably going to look before going back there so I know what they 'should find'.

[altezzaclub]

'I don't think this model has any carburetor and the ignition module in the distributor eliminates the points. '

Ah, my apologies, I was thinking of a 2T motor, but that would be a decade older. So is that a 4AFE motor or similar? Fuel injection and computer-controlled? Any ECU will have fault codes to read as the computer logs problems, you can do that at home. I figure you're in the Americas, and we probably don't have the same model here in Aussie.

Yes, electronic ignition, so no points or timing issues. The only thing needed is a change of spark plugs every few years, a vast upgrade on the old systems. The electronics inside the dizzy are more 'work or not work' than liable to break down occasionally then work again. See if the distributor can be turned by hand, it should be locked tight enough to need a spanner and I can't think of a reason why it would be un-done and the timing change, but you never know....

Take a look and see if it has  a throttle body at the end of the throttle cable, or a carb. A throttle body and throttle position sensor is pretty bullet-proof, the carb still has carb issues. If its a carb there will be a choke mechanism that can play up, an injected system probably has a cold-start injector.

If American, it probably has a stack of anti-pollution stuff on it, I wonder if the oil got into places it shouldn't via that? Out the tappet cover and into the inlet or the many crude mechanical systems they had to reduce pollution back then.

[Banjo]

5 litres overfill, & being driven 14 miles home, has obviously caused issues.  My personal belief, is that the 5 litres overfill, could have well resulted in the crankshaft connecting with the overfilled oil in the sump; which would have it saturating the cylinder walls, below the pistons. Some of this oil would have got past the rings, & foul the spark plugs, which You found to be true, & replaced the spark plugs. However, the greatest damage would be that a of of that excess oil could have splattered the crankcase breathing system, & got back up into the air filter. If the paper air-filter became clogged, it would seriously restrict the amount of air going into the engine.

I'd be changing the air filter element, & maybe the distributor cap. If you have had tracking inside the cap previously, it can create tiny carbon tracks on the inside of the cap, & they will reoccur, unless the cap is replaced. Spark jumping across terminals on the inside of the dissy cap, can be caused by an open circuit spark plug cable or an extra wide spark plug gap; but is more than often caused by the carbon bush in the centre inside of the dissy, either falling out, or the spring behind it breaking.

Once You do find the issue, & get it going properly, I'd be giving the car a good long hard run, on a country road, to bring it back to normal.

Let us know how You go.

Cheers Banjo

 

[oldpops]

Thanks everybody! I probably should have been more specific: This is the 4AFE engine, and the oil place put in about 5-1/2 liters (or about 5-1/4 quarts) in an engine that only takes about 3.3 quarts. So they put in about 2 extra quarts. The engine has about 172,000 miles on it so I'm sure that some of the oil got past the rings and onto the plugs (for some reason, the #3 plug was the worst of the 4 plugs as far as being fouled). "Banjo" mentioned that: However, the greatest damage would be that a of of that excess oil could have splattered the crankcase breathing system, & got back up into the air filter." is something I hadn't thought about, but that would explain the backfires coming out of the air filter box. 

The check engine light doesn't stay on, so would the car still have trouble codes? And what is the procedure for retrieving them?

Since the car runs great (when it starts), I'm going to assume the actual engine timing is good, but I'm probably going to replace the distributor cap and rotor, and then the spark plug wires. And then drive the car a few long drives to clean out any remaining troubles.(I hope).

 

Since I'm here, does anyone know what size bulbs are used for the little lights on the back of the instrument cluster? I know the 3 big bulbs are #194, but the little ones for like the high-beam, brake light, etc., I'm having difficulty find what they are. I would like to have all the bulbs needed to change them out when I pull the instrument cluster (I have to replace the 3 capacitors on the back of the speedometer). I want to do everything at once while the cluster is out. Thanks in advance for help and advice!

[altezzaclub]

You can retrieve the error codes with a $20 OBD reader, or jumping E1 and T1 in the OBD port.  Turning on the ignition puts it into diagnostic mode and the dash lights flash in a timed sequence.

https://kirill-kirillsoncarttec4826.blogspot.com/2010/09/flash-codes.html

Here are some of the codes, you will find others around on the net.

https://www.manualslib.com/manual/1377555/Toyota-4a-Fe.html?page=100

If the check engine light isn't flashing then there is no problem that the motor recognises, although in these early OBD1 setups they recognised only a dozen errors..

[oldpops]

Thanks 'altezzaclub'!  I've never been able to find any OBD1 code reader for this car(without buying an EXPENSIVE OBD scanner for obd1 & obd2 codes - but I'm an old guy and not too good with computers) so if you have a favorite OBD 1 scanner that would work for this car, that would be greatly appreciated)! A OBD1 scanner for this car would really help an old guy like me!  In the meantime, I will see if I can get my son to come over to help me get any codes.

[altezzaclub]

Well, I've never bought an OBD scanner, I just bridge the wires and count the flashes.  America changed from OBD1 to 2 in 1995, so I guess you could have either.

https://www.toyotanation.com/threads/95-corolla-obd2-or-obd1.166019/

The OBD2 scanners are cheap-

https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/296556531303?_skw=obd1+scan+tool&itmmeta=01J88R5ATC8J3J1VCJQ6TX40QF&hash=item450c258e67:g:urcAAOSwjn9mjJpY&itmprp=enc%3AAQAJAAAA8HoV3kP08IDx%2BKZ9MfhVJKmFKLjyhb%2Bl%2B80LcrjWpzfP18U0mkZdicM%2BtoEJmrQg8BATLgyWWbCdsp9m8XmCrmo1EkC2T4S9et6aRKhzwOzo9FN4hh7dY8CZtjP9SAM9d0yTXLM%2BQ6NSxouuaezUwNZdUv6XevlkgbVX8Wqw%2BJCJKEfCDgXigJVIohvH4LI0CoiRI0D2bW5t1jx%2ByCuoBLxQ5%2BYQW68I%2FWoH8jArTfnllve8AptmwSxUPv6%2B4gXMHwoSMjh0Q9wbFKUhz4mxO%2FOWgvMO8B3jPQPi6canOH4v3x%2B%2F5yQLuXa6MRiUwObJmw%3D%3D|tkp%3ABk9SR6itlZjCZA

but OBD1 never had cheap scanners it seems, so they're only professional now as you say, $300 and more!

Here's the AE110 OBD port-

https://www.klavkarr.com/location-plug-connector-obd/Toyota-corolla-8

and there is stacks of people trying to become famous film stars to tell you how to do it-

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OVuug8dohtI

The Geo Prism is the same car I think, like we had Corollas sold as Holdens in Aussie.

How did you go with the air filter/PCV valve/spark plugs?