Brakes. Can Pump Them Up. Need Help

[love ke70]

hey guys,

well I'm having some issues withthe brakes on the 1ggte ke70.

basically what happens is that when you depress the brake pedal it goes down along way and the brakes arnt too sharp.

if you then lift off and quickly back down the "pump up" and i get the stiff pedal i expect

these are ra60 calipers on the front and alfa romeo on the rear, but i don't think that matters

ive replaced: brand new master cylinder, brand new brake pads, brand new fluid, brand new front rotors and remachined rears

there are no leaks and I'm sitting here scratching my head.

i have no issues with them due to the compression braking, but i failed an rwc last week because of this and have since replaced the m/c, pads and fluid

but theyre not much better

however are better when i pump them up

so...

any thoughts?!?

 

cheers, andrew :D

[Raven]

Stock master cylinder will be too small. You need something bigger to compensate for the bigger brakes.

[Killswitch]

air in the lines perhaps?

[love ke70]

theyve past roadworthy before and ive never noticed the problem until recently raven. and they arnt stupendously bigger than stock...

no air in lines, i bled them good and proper :D

[Redwarf]

Drums or discs on the rear?

[love ke70]

drum in disc

disc brakes, handbrake drums

[Redwarf]

Fair enough. That screws my wonderful thought......

[love ke70]

bollucks :D

 

it seemed when i bled it that the front passenger side was never going to stop providing me with air, so i thought it may have been picking it up from the driver side

so bled the drivers side and then redid the passenger side and no more air after a few pumps

dunno if that means anything to anyone :S ;)

[Redwarf]

Brake bleeding 101. (don't take it personally if I'm telling you anything you already know. :D)

 

Start at the brake furthest away from master cylinder, and work towards it.

 

i.e: Rear right, rear left, front left, front right.

 

Oddly enough, if I have air I tend to get it from the rear brakes, and hardly ever from the fronts......

 

If it's a big ingress of air that you've had, you may need to do it more than once. Leave about 20 minutes between bleeds to let everything settle.

 

HTH.

 

R

Edited October 16, 2006 by Redwarf

[love ke70]

yes yes i did bleed them in that order

but like i said was having issues witht he front passenger one. it was just very small amounts of those really small bubbles you get.

 

if anyone wants to come have a look or try bleed them for themselves and ill just do the pedal power feel free.

 

me and dad have downs scores of bleeds though and this is the first to not work...

 

at the end of the day,

ive replaced pads, master cylinder and fluid all with brand new and am still having the same issue of a very low pedal that i can pump up

really makes no sense

and yes the calipers are on the right side, the bleed nipple is at the highest point it can be...

[love ke70]

oh, just read your edit, like i said, its all brand new

so maybe i need to bleed all four again?

i flushed all the lines with compressed air to get rid of any of the yucky shit in the lines *ducks for cover* so the entire system was empty from master cylinder to caliper...

[Redwarf]

I'd go over it at least once, possibly twice for that warm and fuzzy feeling. (God forbid, even a third time if required, as you started from empty.....)

 

Sorry, I didn't know your experience level, so I didn't know how much of the above post to put in. :D

[cuzzo]

I'm thinking its the rubber lines. Do you have these in the ke70??

 

I'm taking the wildest shot but i had ra60 struts in my ke30 and i was using the same rubber hoses that came with the struts. I had the same problem i think your describing. I think it was leaking between the metal join and rubber join in the bracket, but no fluid was coming out.

 

Try this at absolute last resort.

[love ke70]

http://i29.photobucket.com/albums/c292/aro...d2/DSCN0338.jpg

 

theyre the only rubber lines

 

i know they look stretched but theyre not as bad as they appear :D i think the caliper needs twizzling once to give it some slack, not sure...ill do that someday....

 

and yes there is alot of fluid around, this is a result of the aforementioned compressed air ;)

[trd]

gravity bleed it one at a time untill theres no air coming out & it doesn't matter where you start from unless you own a jf holden (dual braking sysems eg: fronts aren't connected to the backs.) there should be NO AIR coming out!!

 

when you change the master cyl do you bleed it up on the bench first or just stick it in the car? you should bleed the master cyl on the bench first before putting in, other wise you could have air trapped in the cyl. put the master cyl off, put it in a vice with a slight angle on it. where the pipes go in should be facing up slightly so the air goes to the top & then bleed it.

 

 

also how are you bleeding it. sounds stupid but theres different ways to do it. best way ive found is to start from a wheel. bleed it until you have some fliud coming out of each wheel then go back & do it again.but this time do each untill there is no sign of air & don't pump the pedal just let gravity do its job & don't use the hose into the bottle tricck just crack the nipple off & let it come out.

 

hope this shit makes sense. hope its a help.

keep us up to date

Edited October 16, 2006 by trd