camerondownunder88 Posted July 11, 2006 Report Share Posted July 11, 2006 Hi All, Today I picked up a working 5 speed gear box out of a KE70 for $50 (has the rest of a car hanging off it but..lol) I want to install this into my KE30 that currently runs a 3K and a 4 speed box. So my main question is to fit it ill I need to remove the engine or can it go in from under neath? Also I know I have to cut the shifter hole back more but will this mean I need a shorter tail shaft? Also will this gear box bolt up to a 3K motor no problem or is the input shaft etc different? Thanks Cameron P.S. once I got the box out the car the car will be for sale and my parents said it can sit in the yard for 2 weeks so if anyone near ipswich wants a good KE70 (blown diff. But has had head work to motor) make me and offer and ill let you know when you can pick it up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
irokin Posted July 11, 2006 Report Share Posted July 11, 2006 Tailshaft will fit. Its only the shifter position that changes not the overal lenght of the box. The clutch and flywheel are most likely the same (KE20s are different). If theyre not get a flywheel off a KE70 and a new clutch kit to suit. The only thing that might be different is 2 bolt positions that have changed on the KE70 (or 4K...I'm not sure exactly when the change happened). Theres still plenty of bolts so no need to worry about it. All the gearbox changes I do are with the engine in the car. Hardest one is the silvia, corollas probably the easiest. Id only take the engine out if space was really an issue and its certainly not in the corolla. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Posted July 11, 2006 Report Share Posted July 11, 2006 Your Speedo cable may be different. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
camerondownunder88 Posted July 11, 2006 Author Report Share Posted July 11, 2006 Hi, If my spedo cable will be different is it a matter of swapping the one from KE70 into my KE30? will it affect speedo reading? Also what clutch and fly wheel will be better one from the KE30 or KE70? Do they both have the same hole pattern? As the KE70 has a racing 6 spring clutch mine has standard KE30 clutch with 375,000km on it..lol Also witht eh cross member will I have to drill any new holes? As I have about 1 week ot do the change and I need the car going so do you guys know any hassels that might come up fixes and anything else I should know? Thanks Cameron Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Felix Posted July 11, 2006 Report Share Posted July 11, 2006 (edited) the speedo cable will be usable. the speedo gears in the box may be different. they can be changed over i believe if you remove the extension housings. you will need to drill 2 holes in your xmember for the gbox mount if you change to the ke70 box. compare your clutches. you may need to change flywheels. it depends on how many dowels there is on the flywheel to locate the pressure plate. think most 3k's have 2 dowel and 4k's have 3 dowel. any issues with belllhousing bolt alignment between the 2 boxes can generally be fixed by changing the engine flex plates over. ie. the plate that bolts to the back of the block behind the flywheel. Edited July 11, 2006 by Felix Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Posted July 11, 2006 Report Share Posted July 11, 2006 I put a ke70 4speed in place of my ke55 auto today. I had to modify the ke70 crossmember and my speedo cable was different. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
irokin Posted July 11, 2006 Report Share Posted July 11, 2006 I put a ke70 4speed in place of my ke55 auto today. I had to modify the ke70 crossmember and my speedo cable was different. Auto is a completely different kettle of fish. When I put a KE70 box in my KE20 I used the KE20 speedo cable without any issues. My KE20 tute http://www.rollaclub.com/articles/gearbox/ Shouldnt be too much different for KE30s any issues with belllhousing bolt alignment between the 2 boxes can generally be fixed by changing the engine flex plates over. ie. the plate that bolts to the back of the block behind the flywheel. We swapped the plate over for the KE70 plate but the bolt holes physically didnt exist in the block. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lappy Posted July 11, 2006 Report Share Posted July 11, 2006 offtopic i didnt know rollaclub had an articles section is there more articles? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bruce Posted July 12, 2006 Report Share Posted July 12, 2006 off topic: I was wondering that too. When I go to the Database section there is "Articles (sorted by)" but it saids "Coming Soon" When I go to "http://www.rollaclub.com/articles/" I get the forbidden page :lolcry: . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Medicine_Man Posted July 12, 2006 Report Share Posted July 12, 2006 www.rollaclub.com/faq/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
camerondownunder88 Posted July 13, 2006 Author Report Share Posted July 13, 2006 Hi, OK back on topic the cross member will have to be drilled if I have to use my original one I got in my KE30. But can I use the one from the KE70 and use it in the KE30 so I don't have to drill holes in the original? Also I have read some diff's in the KE70 5 speeds were different ratios to the diff the 4 speed had. This will mean even if my speedo cable fits in to the box I will have an inaccurate speedo. How can I over come this? Also what can I do to find out what diff my car has to see if it is different or the same ratio as the KE70 and find out if my speedo will be different? Also the clutch I have on my KE30 if it is worn I will use the fly wheel and clutch from the KE70 will this then match the input shaft on the box? And will it all still meet up? And since I will be removing the fly wheel off the motor does anyone have the torque settings for the flywheel bolts on a 3K motor to set my torque wrench to so I don't warp the fly wheel? Also how heavy is on of these K50 boxes could a average man lift one by him self? Thanks Cameron Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Felix Posted July 13, 2006 Report Share Posted July 13, 2006 no idea if the ke70 gbox xmember will fit. it only took a few minutes to drill the 2 holes in my ke1x xmember when i put the ke70 box in it. diff ratios can be worked out in the car. it is a bit fiddly and hard to explain, but i will try: basically you jack up one wheel, make sure the car is safe to lay under, put the car in neutral, with handbrake off. make sure the other wheel can't turn. make a reference mark on the tyre that is free to spin and the diff flange. now what you need to do is get a helper to turn over the free rear tyre exactly 20 times (being exact with the mark and counting), while he is doing that you have to count how many times the diff flange/tailshaft turns. if the diff is a 3.9 the tailshaft will turnover 39 and a bit times. if it is a 4.1 the tailshaft will turn over 41 and a bit times. a 4.2 ...... 42 and a bit times. 4.3...... 43..... 4.4...... 44..... 4.5...... 45..... :lolcry: the speedo drive gears in the gearbox may be different. the gear on the end of the speedo cable isn't hard to get to, but the other one requires the extension housing to come off. Also the clutch I have on my KE30 if it is worn I will use the fly wheel and clutch from the KE70 will this then match the input shaft on the box? And will it all still meet up? And since I will be removing the fly wheel off the motor does anyone have the torque settings for the flywheel bolts on a 3K motor to set my torque wrench to so I don't warp the fly wheel? just try putting the clutch driven plate onto the gearbox input shaft. it will either slip on or it won't. there is supposed to be 2 different input splines on the ke2x to ke70 gboxes. all the ones i have come across have been the same. think the flywheel bolts were 50ft/lb? i'd have to check my manual in the shed tomorrow to say for sure. someone else may have the figure easier at hand. the k50 box isn't that heavy. it is easy to carry one in each hand. bit harder to handle one under a car though with it sitting on your chest. easiest with a helper to lift it onto the back of a motor. just make sure you centralise the driven plate properly or you will be cursing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
irokin Posted July 13, 2006 Report Share Posted July 13, 2006 Hi, OK back on topic the cross member will have to be drilled if I have to use my original one I got in my KE30. But can I use the one from the KE70 and use it in the KE30 so I don't have to drill holes in the original? Doubt it. The KE70 has a different floor pan. Just drill it, its easier. Also I have read some diff's in the KE70 5 speeds were different ratios to the diff the 4 speed had. This will mean even if my speedo cable fits in to the box I will have an inaccurate speedo. How can I over come this? Also what can I do to find out what diff my car has to see if it is different or the same ratio as the KE70 and find out if my speedo will be different? Some had 3.9s but most had 4.1s. Cross that bridge if/when you get to it... http://www.rollaclub.com/faq/index.php?tit...ferential_Gears to find out your ratio. Also the clutch I have on my KE30 if it is worn I will use the fly wheel and clutch from the KE70 will this then match the input shaft on the box? And will it all still meet up? Yes and yes. I swapped the KE20 back to a 4spd (when the K50s seals blew out both ends) and used a KE70 clutch and flywheel without issue so theres a wide compatability range. Also how heavy is on of these K50 boxes could a average man lift one by him self? Teddy put the box in my KE70 by himself. Theyre tiny little boxes (I think I used "cute" to describe one once). You wont have a problem lifting them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Posted July 13, 2006 Report Share Posted July 13, 2006 Hi, OK back on topic the cross member will have to be drilled if I have to use my original one I got in my KE30. But can I use the one from the KE70 and use it in the KE30 so I don't have to drill holes in the original? Also I have read some diff's in the KE70 5 speeds were different ratios to the diff the 4 speed had. This will mean even if my speedo cable fits in to the box I will have an inaccurate speedo. How can I over come this? Also what can I do to find out what diff my car has to see if it is different or the same ratio as the KE70 and find out if my speedo will be different? Also the clutch I have on my KE30 if it is worn I will use the fly wheel and clutch from the KE70 will this then match the input shaft on the box? And will it all still meet up? And since I will be removing the fly wheel off the motor does anyone have the torque settings for the flywheel bolts on a 3K motor to set my torque wrench to so I don't warp the fly wheel? Also how heavy is on of these K50 boxes could a average man lift one by him self? Thanks Cameron Your diff ratio is on an id plate on your diff. The ke70 clutch will obviously match the in-put shaft on the box. loctite the flywheel bolts and do them up f@$king tight with a rattle gun. i don't know the weight difference between the 4 and 5 speed. But i carried my ke70 4 speed out of UPULLIT bymyself and it was pretty light. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
camerondownunder88 Posted July 14, 2006 Author Report Share Posted July 14, 2006 Hi, Well fingers crossed ratio is stamped on the diff as it is a blown diff so can't turn it..lol With the fly wheel if you put it on wrong you will get shudder as this happened on the torana when we had the motor out so if possible the torque settings would be great :lolcry: With the flex plate if the one on the KE70 doesnt allign with my 3K motor can I use the one on the KE30 4 speed to adapt it? As I am a bit un sure about how to go about it? Will I be able to use one or do I need a new flex plate? Also with the gasket between the motor and the box is it reusable and if not how much do they cost? Thanks Cameron Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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