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foodrap

KE20 TE21 1974 Toyota Corolla 1588cc Blowing fuses

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Hey guys. 8 year owner of the above mentioned car. Really stressing now bc I replaced the alternator, plugs, wires, cap, rotor and now after 3 weeks the car isn’t blowing the “HEAT GEN” fuse,third from bottom on the fuse box panel. Car turns on then shuts off? Replaced the fuse Then the key and pop goes the weasel. I can’t figure it out? Any help suggestions as the car is immobile. One thing tho: after the car turns over and starts it will stay on if I give it gas. The second I let go of the gas, she winds down and off.  Starts again but does th same over and over. Blew about 6 fuses last night stuck. 

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Does it have a ballast resister on the the coil? If it is open circuit it gives the symptom of start and stop. I fit has failed you can bridge it out to get her to run but don't leave it too long as it will burn your points. The other option is is the solenoid shut off valve at the carby. It isolates the idle jet so the car wont idle but will run when you open the throttle and get the fuel from the primary jet. Have a look at those two options and let us know how you go.

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Hi Christopher,

                           Big G is right on the ball.  Your symptoms indicate either one or both of his scenarios, are an issue in your car.  Fairly simply fix.

The blown fuses indicate a wire possibly free somewhere, that hasn't been connected, that is intermittently touching chassis, when the car rattles & rolls a bit, whilst starting.

Do let us know how you go.  

Cheers Banjo 

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the other big culprit of this sort of thing is water. I know the issue well unfortunately.
Water getting into a connector usually sits there and conducts enough between suply and earth to blow a fuse.
I don't know the KE20 at all, but "HEAT GEN" soudns to me like,
heater blower motor, and
Generator, meaning the alternator field exciter.
perhasp just check the alternator connector isnt full of water, or melted up against the exhaust.
 

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On 6/27/2018 at 5:15 PM, Big G said:

Does it have a ballast resister on the the coil? If it is open circuit it gives the symptom of start and stop. I fit has failed you can bridge it out to get her to run but don't leave it too long as it will burn your points. The other option is is the solenoid shut off valve at the carby. It isolates the idle jet so the car wont idle but will run when you open the throttle and get the fuel from the primary jet. Have a look at those two options and let us know how you go.

 account  

thats her running on my instagram

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I wish I understood all that. All I know is. The ignition coil maybe near the distributor cap has some loose wires like three.   She started today. Then cut off and never started again. I unplugged the voltage regulator. It still blew the fuse. This happened like back in April. I was driving in rockaway NJ about 45 miles from home and the discharge light or battery light came on. Then the car died. Got s jump and died. Got a jump and made it to auto zone. Swapped the battery out. Drove back to New York. Ordered a Bosch al302x i thinks.  Come to swap it out and the alt don't got no resistor on the back? Ugh!  So I use the one from the corolla off the one I just took out. Pretty much an original Toyota alternator.  It’s in my storage now. So then the car was ok. Then the light Came on. Changed the fuse car was ok then again. So I ordered another alternator. Thought it was def the alt since it was / is the “heat gen”  fuse third from the bottom that’s blowing. I’m thinking. The wires could be crossed? Anyway I get a pure energy 14153 from rock auto. Put it in changed wires, plugs, rotor, Dist cap, can’t find the air filter in stock anywhere and I even put a brand new battery.  This more or less all done the day before I posted that video you to Instagram.  Then I wa driving fine went from manhattan to Brooklyn to queens back to manhattan all Good. Next day I go to take a ride to a friends house and I put her to warm up and then like after a few minutes maybe 7? poof the fuse blew. And car shut off. She keeps turning over then winding off? So I’m thinking a. Swinging short somewhere or crossed wires. Not sure. I’ve only worked on phones and CatV and low voltage but can’t wrap this around my head.  I’m stressing out. Secondly. I don’t have a garage. I got two and a half year old boy and girl twins no baby sitter no job for two years. I’m a stay at home dad who’s Been selling my sneaker collection and the art I bought years ago to get by. Any way that’s the reasons I don’t get much time to put the work into her like I use to. Need a paint job and some light body work. But one day. I promise. That one day she’ll be back in full effect.   

86B26B69-5B4A-49B2-BF2C-BA71844BA4FA.jpeg

Edited by foodrap
Typos

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Your Instagram video appears to display a noise, that I would normally associate with a blown or leaking gasket; maybe on the exhaust system.  This however, would normally not result in blowing a fuse, unless a leaking exhaust, was blowing directly on the rear of the alternator.

Cheers Banjo

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Your selling your shoes in order to eat??

Mate from across the pond, that sucks.

Like banjo said, inspect everywhere near the exhaust, it does show similar symptoms like a swinging wire or something heat related near the exhaust. I have personally experienced it, and it was a bit intermittent so didn't always cause a problem. Mine didn't have any such fuse so it would just bog down then cause the negative battery terminal to become insulated and unconductive till i wiggled it again, leading me to think the source of the problem was the negative battery terminal haha. This went on for a month before I found the intermittently melting field wire on the bottom of the exhaust flange.

Electrical circuitry faults are a difficult thing to diagnose. If u can get one experienced person with a multimeter to just look at it, that may be the difference between throwing money at it, and actually coming to a conclusion.

But check that exhaust area first.

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OK, lets get started-

Do you have a computer?? or do you work off a  phone??  You will struggle to read wiring diagrams on a tiny screen..  If you have a computer go find a free copy of Photoshop, some old one like my Photoshop 6.  They are invaluable for enlarging and sharpening crappy diagrams, but get any program that can do those functions.

This wiring diagram is not labelled as to the model KE, but I expect it is 1970s from the lack of things like the ballast resistor & the carb idle shutoff.  Is yours auto or manual gearbox??

I've shown the ignition & starting circuit in red, you can see it goes from the key to the #1 fuse, then to the coil, hazard lights and alty regulator.

However your problem is nowhere in those, you can see the #1 input is bridged to the #2 and #3 fuses also, so I've labelled #3 circuit in green.

That goes to the back-up (reversing) light switch, the combination meter, speedometer, heater blower motor switch. Your problem is in one of those.

Turn the key onto 'ignition' and see if the fuse blows.  You might as well take the driver's seat out, you'll spend time lying under the dash!  Go find the back-up wires on the top of the gearbox, inspect them then wiggle them, then pull the plug apart so they are disconnected. See if the fuse blew. Then the heater switch, do the same, and finally the ones behind the instruments. Inspect the wires for worn areas with metal showing, especially on the gearbox.

If the fuse blows, look at the thing you were touching when it did.  Leave it disconnected and put in a new fuse, then continue.  You might find a live wire floating around under the dash and solve the whole problem!

With those components disconnected, see if the car runs and the fuse blows.  If it doesn't blow, connect them back up one at a time.  If it blew earlier, connect all the others back up and see if it runs. Once you have it working you can chase down the particular component that blew the fuse. It might be inside a switch.

If the fuse doesn't blow, start the motor.  I'm not clear if the fuse blows when you turn the key to "ignition" or to "Start" or when the motor is running, or whether it does it at any of those times.  Let me know.

The motor dying when it idles is probably related to you changing the ignition components, the fuse blowing being a separate problem. See if we can sort the fuse first..  You can always screw the idle speed up to keep it running.

This wiring diagram came from-

http://uisalumnisage.org/toyota-wiring-diagrams/toyota-wiring-diagrams-0/

I used Photoshop to enlarge and sharpen it.  There will probably be others on the web. It is 1200pixels wide, if Rollaclub shrinks it you can PM me with an email address & I can send it to you.

624174048_KEwiringdiag.thumb.jpg.4ea9992b027913257cfe39398ecbc00f.jpg

Edited by altezzaclub

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I can’t imagine it’s wired incorrectly at the alternator. But who knows.  The mechanic was working a few cars at once.  Also I found wires from around the ignition coil I think that aren’t attached. They look like grounding wires. With metal like u shaped ends.  Didn’t take a pic but I’ll try to tomorrow. Battery is completely dead. Won’t do anything. If there’s a short it could be why also.  No idea.  Any of you guys have a guy in nyc? I’m thinkiking of replacing the ignition coil. That way it’ll have all brand new wires I’m hoping new attachments.  It looks rigged with something. Not sure what it is like a black box or like someone said a resistor on the IG coil. It has three loose wires.  I was like wtf?? I

Edited by foodrap

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Hi Christopher,

                          Bit of a challenge this one, but there are a few of us here in Australia, & Jeremy in the jungle in the Philippines, who are going to try & solve this. This is a bit different for us, because our Rollas, of the same vintage as yours, were fitted with a different engine.  Altezzaclub's wiring digram is for the USA model, so should be very similar, or exactly the same as yours.

The clue you have given us, is your comment  . . . . 

Quote

blowing the “HEAT GEN” fuse,third from bottom on the fuse box panel. Car turns on then shuts off? Replaced the fuse Then the key and pop goes the weasel.

The Rollas from that era, had either a fuse box with 8 fuses, or a fuse box with 10 fuses.

ke2fusecovers.jpg.f9b9c426de46437bbd29829513a5ab97.jpg

I'm guessing your fuse panel is vertical, & has 10 fuses, the same as depicted above on the RHS, and as per the wiring diagram.  The third fuse from bottom on the fuse box panel,is labelled "HEATER".  However, as with all auto fuses, this fuse does supply power to more circuits than just the heater motor/blower.  A quick trace of the wiring diagram, indicates it also powers the reversing lights.  That's a circuit that runs from fuse panel to gearbox reversing switch, to the rear of the car. Does the fuse blow coinciding with putting the car in reverse ?    Do your reversing lights work at all ?

I'm putting my money initially on there being a fault in this circuit somewhere. A Short Circuit to chassis in the trunk somewhere, or in the tail light clusters, could be taking out the fuse, any time you put the car in reverse.  If the reversing lights do not work at all, with an intact fuse, you might have a wiring that has come loose of off somewhere, that is intermittently earthing.

I'll have a further look, & see what else it might be.

Cheers Banjo

 

Edited by Banjo

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This fuse supplies power besides the Heater/Blower On/Off switch; also to the combination meter in the dashboard, as well as the speedo.  I'm guessing the speedo may have a warning light fitted, for the handbrake &/or maybe the stop light circuit.  So there is another couple of places you can look at.  The handbrake switch would be a good starting point.  Does the blowing of the fuse coincide with operating the handbrake, or using the brakes ?

Cheers Banjo 

Edited by Banjo

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As soon as I turn the ignition key and the instrument panel lights come on( battery and oil )the fuse blows. I tried disconnecting the voltage regulator after reading stuff here. Wa sable to drivenit around the block into another spot.  So then I disconnected the battery overnight so it wouldn’t drain and it did just that. Got a jump and as soon as the guy took off the positive lead car just shut off.  I’m so stressed out fellas. Don’t know what to do. Might go get a new battery or charge mine and try to drive it to somebody hat knows how to use a multimeter like someone said.  

Havent seen anything with the brakes as of yet.  Replaced the brake light safety switch two years ago. Not sure but I’ll check that out later on. 

Any if you guys know anyone in NYC I can link up with?

Cheers and and believe lu me guys I am forever indebted to you all for the help and support.  

 

 

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'As soon as I turn the ignition key and the instrument panel lights come on( battery and oil )the fuse blows'

OK, so the short is permanent, which suggests a permanent problem rather than a loose wire waving around. I have a feeling the alternator is incorrectly wired up, if there is a short in there it will take power through the charge light and that will blow fuse #3. I'll add that circuit in blue to the diagram above.

The fact the motor died when the battery was disconnected means the alternator is not working.  Disconnect the alternator & voltage regulator and just confirm the fuse doesn't blow. You could try disconnecting the red light circuit itself as it goes to the alty.  Here's a general setup-

https://www.howacarworks.com/ignition-system/troubleshooting-the-ignition-warning-light

Why did you replace the alty?  Was that the first part of solving some problem that led to the new plugs and leads etc from your first post?

If the battery was disconnected overnight and it went flat, the battery is ruined. If you charged it up it would still go flat the next night. So it is new battery time & isolate the alty. If that  stops it blowing the fuse then you need to have someone look at your alty wiring, or spend some time on Google. That model alty might not be compatible with your external regulator, or a live wire might be touching the casing.

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