Ford Ea And Down Manifold Pattern?

[camerondownunder88]

Hi,

Just collecting information on a project I plan to start one day involving a K motor and ford fuel injection.

So my main question is. The model that came out with the webber on it the XE I think it was also was optional with TBI fuel injection. Now ford ran a similar fuel injection system right up to the EA falcon. So I was woundering are they the same TBI unit or aiflow meter is the SAME mount pattern to the intake manifold there bolted to? Or after the XE with the manifold did it change to big bannana runners etc?

 

Pics appreciated if anyone has a good under bonnet pic of a EA and down falcon fuel injection system. If they own a falcon

 

Cameron

Edited December 17, 2006 by camerondownunder88

[Robert]

Falcon TBI use the same mounting stud pattern as the earlier webers.

 

This is also the same as 32/36 etc, so if youve got an adaptor you can fit it to a K series manifold, youll probably need an aftermarket fuel only computer.

[Raven]

Run an electronic dizzy and you could run the whole thing on an aftermarket computer.

[camerondownunder88]

Hi,

So with a TBI do you HAVE to run an electronic dizzy?

I currently run a MSI CDI kit on the car that the points flick as the sensor then the little computer of the MSI does the rest so ill have to look into this a bit there.

 

Also so the last model of the falcon TBI is the saem pattern? As this is my plan to run TBI on a K motor as well the standard K fuel injection isnt that great and to get power out of it is hard like eg fitting 13B rotary injectors adn a VL turbo throttle body to the front of it but it will still lack from what I am told so I was thinking a TBI ona 3K big port manifold might be the go.

 

Also anyone know the shape of the injector that fits into the TBI off the falcon? Also the aftermarket computer that would fit eg what type you said fuel only type but what features are these missing from a new modern computer? Also is the falcon one useable liek can I re-program it as I was told the EA falcon one was better had more control of the TBI so if possible info on the EA falcon computer would be appreciated.

 

Cameron

[Raven]

I thnk from memory its two injectors in a down-draught throttle body.

 

Not sure on shape though as I only had a CFI motor for a little while before I swapped over to MPFI.

 

The ford ECU's only ran a piggyback. as EEC4 hadnt been cracked at the time to allow modification of the fuel maps. I havent owned a falcon for over a year now, so you best bet would be to jump on ford forums for that.

 

And EA computer would be the best one to use. Make sure its a Series 1 EA Falcon Manual ECU from a CFI Motor (1988-1989), as these don't have any smartlock features which would hinder your starting the car.

Edited December 17, 2006 by Raven

[MRMOPARMAN]

ok first of all.. the TBI only came out on EA-EB's to replace the webber carby on earlier falcons. XE/F's came with carb'd, or multipoint injection.

also the XE/F injection system is completely different to EA-EL injection systems.

as robert said I'm fairly sure the TBI has the same pattern as the webber. i can double check this weekend.

 

the TBI doesnt dictate what sort of ignition system you have to run. it doesnt give a shit. the computer you eventually run will dictate what sort of ignition system you need to run.

 

on ebay atm there is a microtech fuel only ECU for sale. with something like that you can run whatever ignition you like.

it would be near on impossible to impliment the ford ECU to run a corolla.

 

also i believe the falcon TBI would be to big for anything under 2.5-3.0l. alot of people use them in blowthrough on 2l turbo's!

maybe look at pulsar N13 and early camiras. they had a similar TBI system but would be much more suited to a corolla engine.

Edited December 19, 2006 by MRMOPARMAN

[camerondownunder88]

Oh I though the TBI came out ont eh XE as it was optional and it had the same stud pattern as a webber so it can bolt to a rolla. As I have pictures and info on a 1.4L mazda running TBI off a ford so it is just a webber adaptor plate and u can have TBI. So same as a webber.

 

Also thanks for other car ideas eg pulsar N13 , early camiras never knew they had them. Do you know anymore that have them? In hte small engine market?

 

Also in the TBI ford system can you changethe injector?

 

Cameorn

[Des]

don't EB's have mulit point injection. :'(

Edited December 19, 2006 by too quick

[Raven]

Yep, EB Falc's are MPFI :'(

[MRMOPARMAN]

EB series 1's had the 3.9 with TBI standard, optional MPI, series 2 got the 4.0l and they dropped the tbi.

 

umm some early mitsu's, cordias for instance and some lancer models, and i think some honda's got TBI's as well.

 

do you have any info on the mazda running the ford TBI? id be very interested in getting some info on it.. is it blown?

[camerondownunder88]

Hi,

Yes earlie EB was TBI. But the XE was alos optional TBI if you didnt want a webber. But ford no longer make spare part for this TBI anymore so I will prefer the newer EB one. If it has aweber pattern. As if you have a webber adapter for a rolla you can bolt on TBI and have injection for about $100 if you get parts and do it your self cheap. Then it is easy turbo.

 

The mazda is on Ausrotary.com

at: http://ausrotary.dntinternet.com/forums/vi...69dbc39bb774626

You will haev to sign up to see it but if you can't be bothered here are a few pics.

 

So yes it is turboed..lol But can you change the injectors in a TBI system for ford? but ill look at a local wrecker for a few different TBI systems.

 

 

Cameron

[MRMOPARMAN]

actually mate.. I'm 99.9% sure XE's never came with TBI, only had 250 with webber carb, MPI injection, or V8 carb. but anyways, yes you can change injectors on the EA-B TBI's. ive heard that you can get them in different flow cap's too, but never bothered to look into this.

 

thanks for the pics of the maz. ill have to check it out when i get a bit more time.

[camerondownunder88]

Hi,

Ok ill go searching on the XE as I had you tell me they don't have TBI but a mechanic from denmac ford tell me they do and a info page i found on one so ill take you word for it and go for a newer model. As even if the XE had TBI I would still prefer the newer one as they had a better computer. JUst if you plan this be careful the last Ford TBI system had security in it like smart lock and I was told I will have trouble wireing this up and if I don't the computer wont start the car as it will think it was stolen so.

 

Cameron

[Raven]

Obviously you didnt read my post regarding TBI Cameron. The EA Falcon with TBI never came out with Smartlock. So just use an EA ECU.

[Dan]

Nope, this TBI thing that everyone is talking about is commonly termed in ford circles as 'CFI'. It is a SHIT injection method, loses power, and is generally absolutely shithouse and hard to extract power off. It is two injectors in a sidedraught manifold as mentioned earlier.

 

EA Falcon GLs never came out with MPFi as standard, it was always an option. I'm pretty sure the only EA chassis that came with standard MPFi was the Fairmont Ghia and NA fairlane.. Also, yes, CFI EAs did not run smartlock, whereas the series 2 MPFi ones did

 

You can get over this with a smartlock override unit, it fools the ECU into thinking that the car has smartlock working and stuff.

 

I wouldn't for the life of me convert anything to the early style CFI injection. It is a shit injection that everyone in Ford circles aims to get rid of asap, the only reason you'd stay with CFI is for a LPG orientated setup.

 

For clarification;

EA had CFI standard on most models and MPFi as an available option, was a power boost of 20kw for MPFi.

EB-ED had MPFi as standard, however s1 EB had EAs 3.9L motor

EF had MPFi, which is termed as BBM(broadband manifold). They also ran coilpacks, which while had there merits were a headf@$k and needed alot of R+D to perfect. They went back to normal ignition for EL

EL also had the BBM MPFi.

 

I have a EF/EL conversion kit for the next EA that I come across :'(

 

 

When it comes down to it man, you don't want to run the CFI injection.. seriously.. after owning a CFI EA I was depressed with the lack of throttle response, lack of power and lack of... lackness..

 

Dan