Suspension

[Redwarf]

"Bugger this. I want more castor." I hear you logically say. Well, you can machine down, your castor arms, and tap more thread onto them., This in theory gives you an infinite amount more adjustment. But there is more than one way to skin a cat.

(Pic of turned down and threaded castor rod, KE25)

 

Sorry about the crappy photo.

Edited May 26, 2005 by Redwarf

[Redwarf]

Now, by lengthening your lower control arms, you are therefore pushing the point at which your castor rod mounts out from the car(Blue line). Your castor rod, being a defined length(yellow), will at the same time, swing the lower control arm forward (red), therefore, giving you more castor, as well as neg camber, with isn't really a bad thing.

[Redwarf]

However. Getting much more than 2.5 to 3 degrees out of the rubber bushings, isn't that easy, as, although it has some give, it does say enough at a certain point. You can get around this a number of ways. The way I chose was by rose jointing the lower control arm. (Disclaimer: This method is frowned upon by most departments of transport!) Right. Now we have that out of the way, this is achieved by cutting your lower control arm, welding a decent sized hunk of steel into the end, drilling it, and then tapping it to the desired rose joint size. Piccies below gives a good idea of what is to be done.

Edited May 26, 2005 by Redwarf

[Redwarf]

Now, as your rose joint is significantly smaller than the original end to the lower control arm, you need to make up a couple of spacers. Spacers should be made from some sort of robust metal, and not be too large so as to interfere with the movement of the rose joint.

[Redwarf]

By these methods, I have around (in dirt trim, more in tarmac) 2'30" neg camber, and 4'30" of castor on a KE25. I think I've rambled on a bit much, and probably given far too much info, but hey, I had fun. More than happy to provide more photo's to anyone who is interested. Hope this helped, Banjo.

Edited May 26, 2005 by Redwarf

[Redwarf]

Usually, you'd complement Koni shocks/struts with K MAC springs and swaybars.

My brother used Monroe and Pedders, he thinks he had better handling and a better sit with Monroe, to be honest, which is to my suprise. I here good and bad about Pedders.

 

I may just pay the bucks and go Koni Adjustables, KMAC springs, and the back leaves... well, I need to inquire about kits for a KE55, or do you just take out one of the leaves out? What do I do with the back?

I use Pedders as I get it at the right price! :)

 

I wouldn't go chasing a particular brand of spring, more what height and poundage you are requiring. I tend not to touch swaybars, but that's just the way I like cars set up.

 

There is a great book by Fred Puhn called "How to make your car handle". It is the bible. If you want to go hardcore with suspension or want just a really good technical read, buy it, read it, digest as much as you can, then read it again. Repeat as often as required.

Edited May 26, 2005 by Redwarf

[mikeys toy[RL]]

when i take a corner HARD in daisy it will lift the inside wheel off the ground 4" or more, then the outside wheel will break traction and i either do a good job of drifting, or i lose it and spin off into the ditch

this has gotta be fixed

i am running stock starlet (kp61) struts and stock cut springs

i didtched the transverse leaf long ago.

i just bid on some adjustable coils on ebay

can anyone tell me what the stock spring rate was for a kp61?

and wtf does that mean

[Banjo]

Rob,

Thanks for that, and all the camera work down in the garage. We are all a little wiser now.

 

I figured it was something like that.

 

All the manuals I have read indicate that when fitting new rubber bushes to the inner end of the lower control arm, that they should NOT be fully tightened until the car is lowered to the ground.

 

This is presumably to provide some torsional effect from the rubber to the suspension, both up & down from the neutral position.

 

I thought that maybe the rubber bushes provide more of this torsional effect than the poly ones, which are usually covered with the special dry lubricant provided with each set of bushes.

 

With your rose joint mod, this torsional effect is presumably lost, so have you had to compensate for this elsewhere in the suspension setup, or doesn't it matter in your rallying application ?

 

Thanks again !

 

Banjo

 

:)

[Redwarf]

All the manuals I have read indicate that when fitting new rubber bushes to the inner end of the lower control arm, that they should NOT be fully tightened until the car is lowered to the ground.

 

This is presumably to provide some torsional effect from the rubber to the suspension, both up & down from the neutral position.

 

Correct, and yes and no.

 

The reason behind tightening them on the ground is so that the bushes neutral position is in a load free application. This reduces undue torsional tension on the bush. The bush itself, (and I may be a little of the mark here, but it's my understanding of the matter) is basically there to provide vibration isolation and movement for castor. The... I suppose you would call it torsional friction?... plays no real part in the dampening process, other than reducing vibs.

 

With your rose joint mod, this torsional effect is presumably lost, so have you had to compensate for this elsewhere in the suspension setup, or doesn't it matter in your rallying application ?

 

Due to the above statement, it doesn't really matter. Rose joints, however, cop a pounding because there is no dampening, and are very susceptable (sp?) to wear, and the chassis needs to be inspected semi-regularly, particularly after big hits.

 

On reading that, I think I made it clear as mud, and am happy to answer further!

 

R

[Banjo]

Rob,

You are spot on !

 

Thanks !

 

:thumbsup:

[Super Jamie]

and it's for that reason rose joints are illegal on the street. stupid laws :thumbsup: