Ke70 Cas/cam Angle Sensor

[yohan18]

Hey guys I have come to a stop in my build.

I have a worked 5k block/4k head with Solid lifters and cam.and a sc12

I have recently bought a 4ke efi manifold and microtech lt8 ecu

 

Now the problem I'm having is I have no trigger for the injectors.

I'm in need of assistance on how to fit a cam sensor into the dizzy or

A crank sensor.

 

Just wondering if you guys have done this. Have read a few pages and nothing really outlines what exactly was used and how it was achieved.

Any help would be appreciated

 

 

Thanks mathew

[ke70dave]

An electronic distributor with a Hall effect sensor should drive the microtech if the microtech can be setup so that it receives 1 pulse per spark event. I did this exact same thing with an electronic distributor on my suzuki g13a with a haltech e8. Electronic distributors come from 5k's? I think.

[yohan18]

Ive got a 4ku electronic distributor. But haven't been able to get it to work like that. I havent got a hand held or computer to be able to change any setting in the ecu yet...

 

The hall affect how does that work?? Would that distributor have 2 or more wires?

[ke70dave]

Can someone else tell me if the 4ku dizzy is hall effect? I'm almost certain it would be.

 

The hall efect is basically a bit of metal that a magnet passes over, and as the magent passes over current is generatged in the metal. and as the current direction switches as the magnet passes over the ecu picks this up as a trigger event.

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hall_effect_sensor

 

The hall effect sensor itself has two wires on it, and these should go straight into your microtech. Polarity is important though. You got a wiring diagram for the lt8?

 

But you arnet going to get anywhere unless you can get inside it and change the settings. The trigger setting needs to be single pulse per ignition event with the trigger angle set to 180degrees. (as you get 4 triggers per 720 degrees, so its 1 per 180 of the crank)

 

You are going to need an ignition module as well for the ecu to drive the coil. What are your plans for this?

 

Ive got an old laptop here with a serial port which i use on my E8. Where abouts are you located?

[yohan18]

Ive got a bim 024 module but I think I broke it. I'm not getting any positive out of it now meaning the dizzy isnt getting at power to send spark. With or with the ecu plugged in.

I wasnt going to use the ecu for spark but it looks like I will have to.

 

Ive been following the lt8 diagram to the extent where I can remember most colours.

The cranking wire grey/blue I tried to hook that up to the module like it said but it didnt work but I think that's what broke the module.

 

The 4ku dizzy is locked, I don't know much about distributors.never pulled one apart so bare with me on the internals

 

I'm located algester 4115

 

Mathew :)

[ke70dave]

hmm its difficult to destroy the igntion module, i have one of those as well, i connected it up wrong and it got so hot i thought it was going to spontaneously combust....still works!

 

From this:

 

http://microtechefi.com/download/LT8_%20STD%20IGNw.pdf

 

You need to find the two wires in your locked distributer that connect to the sensor. and sounds like you connect them to red and blue on the ignition input 4 pin plug. Did you do do this?

 

But yeah like i said, you wont get anywhere unless you can change the internal settings.

[yohan18]

Nahh I tried to wire it up like the single distributor on the second page of the pdf file you loaded.

I havent been inside the distributor to find the wires. I'm at work at the moment so its hard to say what is there until this arvo.

 

The 4 pin plug on mine are all red besides the earth. if the wires are there in the dizzy which one should I use the crank signal 1 or 2 and the positive?

 

I think I have a laptop with the pc port same as the adaptor that I got with the ecu. I shall have a look this arvo about those to things.

 

But with that module I'm not getting nothing at the dizzy. Well wasnt last night when I was checking. Every thing was back to standard

[kickn5k]

If the microtech isn't configured for your setup, it will never work 100% right.

They usually print all the info on the back of the ECU.

 

[yohan18]

I just want to get everything connected right before trying.

The lt8 ecu that I got was programmed for a 4agze.

I dunno how different my setup is compared to 4 agze but id say its pretty close to be able to get it started atleast.

 

Ive emailed microtech they havent replied to me yet.

[ke70dave]

yeah you got no chance of getting it to work unless you use a 4agze CAS then, which i don't belive you can put into a 4kc.

 

I dunno how much you know about trigger patterns and how the ECU works, but essentially you program in what the trigger pattern of your CAS is, and if you give it something different (ie different trigger pattern) you will get zero results.

Edited April 24, 2014 by ke70dave

[yohan18]

So I guess the only other option is to get it remapped? ?

Get it remapped to suit the dizzy that I've got and get everything else that needs to be changed at the same time.

 

Or?? Would using a 4agze type crank sensor work instead of cam angle sensor?

I don't even know what a 4agze cam sensor looks like.

 

I few guys on here have used mitsubishi cas. But there is no specifics on it.

 

 

[ke70dave]

From a bit of a google it sounds like its preprogrammed and must be sent back to get it changed. which is a pain beacuse you will be dealing with a non standard arrangement and you want to make sure you are absolutely sure what the trigger patten is before you do it.

 

I pesonally would try and get a 4agze cas onto your 4kc. perhaps you can combine a 4agze cas and a 4kc distributer together? so you get the gearside of the 4kc distributor and the electronic 4agze cas. Gonna take some thought though and some custom machining.

 

The 4agze cas has 2 wheels in it, it has a 24 tooth with and a 4 tooth "home" signal (check these numbers). it is quite advanced and will allow sequential fuel injection, where as if you get it to work with your 4kc distributor all you will have is batch fired injection.

 

Also one thing you can look into, alot of the 4age guys put a 4kc distribtor onto their 4ages when they run carbies. a 4agze cas bolts up to a 4age, so you are basically doing the opposite of this (4age cas onto a 4kc). So perhaps do a bit of research on this.

Edited April 24, 2014 by ke70dave

[yohan18]

Ahhh that is really helpful.

I'm a fitter and turner by trade so machining is easy. So really ive gotta make the top of a 4agze dissy bolt to the bottom of my 4kc. This sounds "interesting"

I shall do some research and see what I can come up with thanks.

 

If I do this do you think that is all I shall have to do. Its a 1.5 block supercharged. Pretty close configurations.

[Taz_Rx]

Its not a matter of 'remapping' the ecu.... It needs to be 'configured' correctly. Its most likely setup as a dual pulse trigger from the 4agze.

 

K series electronic dizzy's are a reluctor type. It does need to be locked. Also need an external igniter type or bypass the internal igniter. Adjusting the air gap can be rather important in getting a steady pulse especially at low rpm, ie starting. A trick we used on mine when fault finding the trigger setup was to remove the dizzy and put it in a cordless drill which spun it at about 1500rpm.

 

And why do you have any + connected to your igniter? It should only have 3 wires connected - the ecu trigger, which is a -pulse, a ground, and a connection to the - side of the coil to discharge it. The igniter should not be connected directly to the dizzy in any way!

[yohan18]

At the moment I havent changed to that ecu trigger yet.

I tried and nothing work so I changed it back.

The positive I'm talking about is from when you turn the key on the power sends to the module from the coil. I followed that how to install a electronic distributor guide on here.

 

So with the trigger attached it should just be positive to the coil and from the coil to the dizzy?