Help With Mechanical Mumbo Jumbo...

[ke70dave]

First things first, do yourself a favor and hit that magical little button just above where you are reading this. "knowledge base/FAQ". there is a nice little artical labeled "how to build a tough K motor". good read.

 

now onto your specific questions (specific questions are good):

 

Ok that's the things I needed to hear, but a few questions if you don't mind...

1. Out of the 32/32 down draft or 40mm side draft Weber what is better? (for a stock 4k)

 

ive no idea, both are considered upgrades. the side drafts certainly look awesome. and if you get the twin carbys you can get it running really good. though don't expect it to be a powerhouse if the only thing you have done to it is a new carby. youll need to bump up the compression and put a different camshaft in to get the real benefits out of a better flowing carby.

 

2. With the extractors what type, brand, size etc. and full size exhaust, size type etc.

 

any will do, find some on here for like $150. the standard manifold is so terrible i bet it would even run better without it!!! (ok thats a lie, as it would run terribly, but you get the idea) and don't go over 2" with the exhaust, some people even say 1.75". you might be able to find an exhaust on here for sale, seen a few lately.

 

3. The 3k head that is meant to bolt straight on, is it a stock untouched one straight off the 3k engine? and what does it do?

 

apparnetly its got bigger ports, and it will raise the compression a bit. ive never done it. some people rave about it, others don't. plenty of info around about the head swap. pluss all 3k heads are now over 30yrs old, so id say your better off getting a spare 4k head and giving it a shave and having a bit of fun with a dremel.

 

4. A lumpier cam? When i drive i normally get the maximum revs i can.

 

dunno if this is a question. I'm ron burgundy? getting the maximum revs wont help you when your stuck in traffic and needing to rev it to 4k to get anywhere.

 

5. and by decent clutch you mean.... brand, model etc.

 

its a 4k, it has as much torque as a spinning broom (standard unmodified house broom) just get the exedy heavy duty. not that much more than a standard replacement. ive got one on my 16v 4age, plenty of bight! where to buy? any parts shop. with like..you know...car parts.

 

good luck! and read that FAQ article i mentioned.

Edited November 4, 2009 by ke70dave

[beerhead]

3K "bigport" head. Name says it all, has slightly larger ports than a 4K, but are generally getting so ratty by now that most people just port out a 4K head to the same size. Have a look in the building a tough K motor in the FAQ.

 

Lumpy cam is just referring to its idle, if it sounds lumpy it normall has a longer duration and more top end power. Most modded street K motors run a 25/65 or 70/30 cam. Cheap as to get a regrind made - Tighe cams in Brisbane is a common choice here, will make a cam to your desires.

 

I don't like the 32/36 webbers on a 4K, they're just a little too big, great up top end, but sacrifice the bottom end of the powerband. In the past I used to run a rejetted Nikki gemini carby with a very lumpy cam. Had decent economy and some get up and go. If you don't mind spending $1000 on carby's definitely go some side draft 40mm webbers /dellorto's.

 

Extractors show up from on the club and ebay time to time, I'm not sure if pacemaker still has new ones on shelf. 2 - 2 1/4 " exhausts is normally what people run on the K motors if you want a racy sound, 1 3/4 " system is the go if you don't want it to attract attention.

 

Factory toyota clutches are strong as, just see if it slips first. I'd go an exedy heavy duty if you have any drama's.

[tylerrice]

That's the stuff I need to hear... i have read that tougher motor thing but a lot of it just dosen't make sense the way you have explained it has helped a lot, and is much appreciated. Thanks Ke70dave and beerhead.

 

if possible could anyone post a simple setup in the way i requested before that would help heaps.

 

Thanks again

 

P.S everytime i try to visit the FAQ section i get the following message (only happens with that one page) :

 

Website Maintenance

 

The website you are attempting to reach is currently undergoing maintenance and will be back online shortly.

 

If you are the administrator for this site or require further information, please contact your hosting provider.

[white_sandshoe]

Just remember the three c's of performance engine building.

 

Compression

 

Cams

 

Combustion

 

Basically... rule of thumb is the higher the compression, the more power... Most standard engines run about 9.5 or 10:1 if you do something silly like run 25:1 it'll just go bang... For sensible street use with pump fuel, bumping it up to 12:1 is good enough.

 

This is what the 3K head does. I forget the actual figure, but i think it's like 11.5:1 or something.

 

When it comes to cams, that pretty much means anything that'll make the engine breathe easier. that in itself is what the cam does by pushing the valves open earlier, keeping them open longer and pushing them further down. As stated, taking a stock cam into Tighe cams or pretty much anyone who grinds them, and requesting either of the profiles mentioned will get you what you're after.

 

It's also important to let the inlet and exhaust flow easier too. Without going into the further technical detail of backpressure and the like, as previously stated about a 2" exhaust is about all you'd need for a well performing street car.

As with carburettors, a 32/32 weber should be good, and won't have the same flat spot a 32/36 would have.

Personally I'd suggest a single 45mm weber or possibly a twin SU setup (as is currently for sale for $300 here on the forum) would be a good match.

 

Combustion means the time during the piston movement that the spark plug makes it all go boom... I'm not entirely the best person to ask about this, but I understand that about 14 degrees BTDC (Before Top Dead Centre) is about what you'd look at running on a modded 4K engine with the above mods... But get someone who knows about setting timing to do this...

 

The reason I recommended getting the 3K head and doing it up is that you can do all of the work piece by piece without any downtime of the car itself until you get to the point of swapping it over. Also, It'll make for a much more noticable boost in performance.

 

There's nothing worse than doing a mod to your car and wondering why the super performance promised isn't there... And not realising it's because the rest of the stock system is holding it back.

Edited November 4, 2009 by white_sandshoe

[tylerrice]

sweet, thanks heaps white_sandshoe.

 

I love the way you describe and explaine things it makes it easyier to understand for someone who know shit all about the engines.

 

I have looked at these: Twin SU Carbs

but are they any good, some of the people seem a bit hesitant about them?

[Taz_Rx]

and Taz RX, how much did it cost for that setup???

 

Less than a 4age conversion! :rock: I've never really tallied it..... and don't want to. :) A lot of it was more so just for learning about EFI etc. There's also a few 'wanky' little bits that weren't completely neccessary (like speedflow lines, gilmer etc) so it could of been done cheaper.

My original 4ktc setup cost me about $400 for 7-8psi.

 

Taz could you please write up a stock list of what you have in that car and the rough prices :) That is very very nice...

 

Click "Tar" in my sig and start the 40+ page trawl. There's a full specs list there somewhere. :)

[tylerrice]

haha thanks will start searching now :)

 

I would like to have a turbo in the car like I said just to make it flutter:

1. what would i need to do that?

2. roughly how much is it going to cost

 

 

 

can anyone link me to a good online car parts shop or one in SA for the carby, turbo and other parts that may be needed.

[Taz_Rx]

I would like to have a turbo in the car like I said just to make it flutter:

1. what would i need to do that?

2. roughly how much is it going to cost

 

:) If you only want a turbo for the full-hektik flutterz sound then don't waste your money on an actual turbo........

 

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Fake-Blow-O...sQ5fAccessories

 

 

:)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qga5eONXU_4

[philbey]

I have done some reading and looking around here and there and have got a small understanding of a few things but its not the best and when i read things like How to build a Tough K Series Engine i get confused with most of the Mechanical talk....

 

First things first, do yourself a favor and hit that magical little button just above where you are reading this. "knowledge base/FAQ". there is a nice little artical labeled "how to build a tough K motor". good read.

 

haha pot calls kettle black. Gold.

 

Tyler, you've got a shitload of good info in the thread now to get started with. Next thing you should do is work out your actual budget and cashflow: Do you have 3 grand to spend now or will you have 3 grand to spend spread over 12 months?

 

secondly, don't expect a shopping list of bits to go out and buy and your done; K engines aren't an RB25 where you just roll down to the speed shop and buy some bolt on go fast bits. The other thing is that most of us spent hours trawling the web, crawling through wreckers talking to machinists/engine builders etc and we're probably all forgetting exactly what we used and where.

 

We're all keen to help, but we're not going to give you a walkthrough.

 

Now you need to start reading up; Search for "internal combustion engine animation", "how does a camshaft work" and "what is a compression ratio" in google and read up. Engine theory is very well documented on the web, some of the american websites are very detailed. If you learn up this whole thing will be much much easier.

 

My suggestion would be:

 

- 5k engine with a 5K head (rebuilt, shaved to increase compression, ports matched to the manifold of your choice)

- stock manifold with a 32/32 dgv weber OR even the SU's you asked about. They're good carbs and should be a bit more straightforward than using Sidedraft Webers/Dellortos

- Extractors, just go for whatever set you can find, check Ebay. 3k 4k and 5k are all the same. HM Headers make them Link

- Clutch, just get the Exedy Sports Tuff heavy duty to suit your gearbox, there's only 2 options depending on which model car you've got.

 

the 5K is bigger displacement so you straight away are making more power. I've built one myself, I'm running twin dellortos, high compression, big ass mystery cam and custom installed oil leaks. Have a look through my build thread in the link in my signature.

 

To get your engine built, go see TW Engineering in St Agnes in adelaide. They'll do headwork, engine work and will be able to help get the parts you need to rebuild it.

[Toy-Yoda[RL]]

Another option if you just can't be bothered looking and learning is just buy one that's already built, often works out cheaper and then all you have to do is try to not blow it up...... (Yoda would like to point out that this is not intended to sound mean or condescending in any way, and is merely trying to lay down the simplest possible truths)

 

Taking into account your budget, Try this on for size.

 

All you need to do with that is make a giant does pipe and you're set :) Unless you're still set on the V8 sound thing in which case, look into getting one of these fitted, relatively cheap and you get the noise without the shocking handling or fuel usage....... Vroom vroom, I has a V8

 

Hope this helps a bit.

[altezzaclub]

Ah- I've been avoiding this thread because Tyler knows ABSOLUTELY FKING NOTHING!!!

 

So now you know where you are starting from!

 

Mr Philbey has the best advice of all...

 

Now you need to start reading up; Search for "internal combustion engine animation", "how does a camshaft work" and "what is a compression ratio" in google and read up. Engine theory is very well documented on the web, some of the american websites are very detailed. If you learn up this whole thing will be much much easier.

 

and I can only add...

 

Get a workshop manual & give the car a tuneup. Yourself, in your garage.

 

Then get a better carby and fit it yourself. Yourself, in your garge. It will require modifications of all sorts, no matter which carb you pick. If you get stuck, THEN ask your mate or post up here.

 

Once you have achieved this you will have a much better idea of how little you know and if you able to learn to do all the work on cars yourself.

 

After that, your learning to work on cars will accelerate! Given five years the 'rolla will be a pocket rocket and you will know more than most mechanics about it!

[tylerrice]

stuff the V8 sound, I'm getting to fussy :) lol

 

I don't want to buy a car outright because I don't have the money up front and I want that feeling of doing my own the driving around in it, much more satisfying.

The $3000 would have to be stretched over time and would have to be the maximum to spend

 

also with a turbo like Taz_Rx's "TD04-L turbo" what will that do for the car... (just noticed in the pic's that its a CT12 Turbo whats that gonna do for the car compared to the TD04-L?)

if it is a decent benefit i would rater install one of them than use some fake thing...

Edited November 5, 2009 by tylerrice

[Taz_Rx]

Toy-yoda's link.....

 

...........and make your RX-8 sound like a 71’ Hemi Cuda?”

 

Why the hell would you want to do that!!!!! :).... any off topic.

 

I'm now on turbo kit #3. #1 was the CT12 (which was pretty crap cause the turbo was soooooo small) and #2 was the TD04-L (from a later model wrx) which was great. :) I sold my whole TD04-L and KTC setup for $1150 fitted.

[styler]

tylerrice mate, you are like a fat kid in a candy shop!

 

seriously, people on here are more than polite with you and you need to show some respect

and return the gratitude without wasting everyones time they have kindly given to you...

 

you can't have v8 sound and flutter and turbo and lumpy cam and carbs and and and...

all of that for a quick visit to the local shops with a few hundred bucks and install it in 2 hours

with your local mate jimmy who owns a shifter and some random sockets...

 

it doesnt even make effen sense!

 

so... work with us on here, you obviously have a passion :)

 

some basics of building a car 101:

 

you:

 

money

skills

tools

knowledge

time

 

the car:

 

condition bought

quality of build

car use - street/track/drag/drift

performance

reliability

cost

 

that is a good start to the basics of it all...

 

once you answer the above criteria we can at least understand you and offer some guidence

in the right direction, its not easy, its not quick and its not cheap to do it right...

 

its is a pain at times, can be time consuming and costs a moderate amount if you educate yourself

to a reasonable degree, search for answers first and ask a few questions on forums and you will slowly

get into it and learn as you save up and work on the car.

 

else you can go out a buy a car outright thats reasonably quick, a cheap jap import or old v8 pending

driving laws in your state.

Edited November 5, 2009 by styler

[Taz_Rx]

else you can go out a buy a car outright thats reasonably quick, a cheap jap import or old v8 pending

driving laws in your state.

 

EXACTLY!!! I believe SA doesn't allow P platers (I'm guessing you are) drive V8's...... or turbo cars. So you're also pushing shit uphill wanting a fluttery FPV sound anyway........ unless your mum drives you round it it! :) :)

A South Aussie please correct me if I'm wrong.