4age

[Medicine_Man]

Read this

 

http://www.rollaclub.com/faq/index.php?tit...ries_Engine_FAQ

 

Simple guide I wrote up ages ago for newbies..

[camerondownunder88]

Ok to please Littleredspirit...I am a Technofobe K motor fan :lol: BUT Just gotta add this.

 

20V can be made to MAKE serious power.......LINK BELOW.......

 

http://www.rollaclub.com/board/index.php?s...=13091&st=0

 

Now this car I KNOW the owner personally. The person who built it have ridden in it etc....Now on the dyno this made 450HP at 28PSI. His ride page says estimated..That is because we HAVE taken the car safely up to 37PSI (turbo was running very inefficient). The reason we ESTIMATE 450HP is because on the dyno the car started to slip as they just couldn't strap it down properly due to it being FWD and mods on it. So they didn't risk it and make more power. And as you can see this car has custom engine mounts to hold the motor due to power and it is all mod plated and legal so not 1 illegal thin on it apart from currently it is like 5mm to low..LOL

 

So I will disagree with the comment that 20V can't make much power. Wrong they can as you can see above. A lot of money was thrown on this package. BUT a lot was also labor buying 2 4a motors (20V + gze) If your smart buy the head and a 4agze block save some $$. Also a lot of cost on the car can be made cheaper. So if you want a nuts car follow this build from the receipts and do it cheaper/your style and you will for a few grand less get a similar package.

 

And IF and I mean IF the engine is built strong a High-ish CR motor can take boost. I work with a good mate who has a for transit van fitted with a ford V8 with 10:1 CR and he runs 10PSI boost from a small supercharger. Mean car adn works daily driven. So you can have high CR and boost not best combo but can be done. But again I'm not sure on the strength of the 20V with the high CR so can't recomend doing it personally until I had know strength facts.

 

Cameron

[Trev]

I will put my N/A bigport against any engine here :lol:

[7shades]

I painted the rocker cover on my GF's car pink and it goes waaaaay faster now. Fo rizzle.

[Hiro Protagonist]

So I will disagree with the comment that 20V can't make much power

 

Cameron

 

The debate isn't about 20Vs not making power. It's about them not being able to make much power N/A without serious dollar spendage, especially compared to a 16V

[Trev]

Ok to please Littleredspirit...I am a Technofobe K motor fan :lol: BUT Just gotta add this.

 

20V can be made to MAKE serious power.......LINK BELOW.......

 

http://www.rollaclub.com/board/index.php?s...=13091&st=0

 

Now this car I KNOW the owner personally. The person who built it have ridden in it etc....Now on the dyno this made 450HP at 28PSI. His ride page says estimated..That is because we HAVE taken the car safely up to 37PSI (turbo was running very inefficient). The reason we ESTIMATE 450HP is because on the dyno the car started to slip as they just couldn't strap it down properly due to it being FWD and mods on it. So they didn't risk it and make more power. And as you can see this car has custom engine mounts to hold the motor due to power and it is all mod plated and legal so not 1 illegal thin on it apart from currently it is like 5mm to low..LOL

 

So I will disagree with the comment that 20V can't make much power. Wrong they can as you can see above. A lot of money was thrown on this package. BUT a lot was also labor buying 2 4a motors (20V + gze) If your smart buy the head and a 4agze block save some $$. Also a lot of cost on the car can be made cheaper. So if you want a nuts car follow this build from the receipts and do it cheaper/your style and you will for a few grand less get a similar package.

 

And IF and I mean IF

the engine is built strong a High-ish CR motor can take boost. I work with a good mate who has a for transit van fitted with a ford V8 with 10:1 CR and he runs 10PSI boost from a small supercharger. Mean car adn works daily driven. So you can have high CR and boost not best combo but can be done. But again I'm not sure on the strength of the 20V with the high CR so can't recomend doing it personally until I had know strength facts.

 

Cameron

 

Cam there is also not alot of 20v left on that turbo corolla 2 and wasnt there over 10grand in parts put into the engine?

 

The debate isn't about 20Vs not making power. It's about them not being able to make much power N/A without serious dollar spendage, especially compared to a 16V

 

Agree but disagree, Alot of engines require a fair amount of money to make decent power in N/A form, The best power vs money engine i have personally seen is my brother's 308, Its just a dirty old 308 with headwork and a balanced bottom end with a 750 DP carby, All up his engine owes him 5k makes over 400hp and can be driven daily without worrying about breakdown, Its backed by a kitted trimatic running into a 9inch and it runs consistent 12.5's with a best time of 12.2 in full street body trim LJ 2 door (full interior etc, Only thing missing is heater and factory fuel tank), Now look at all the dipshits that spend 18K + building an engine to run 1 second quicker (yes 1 second is alot in drag racing) but they also arent consistent and breakdown is more likely.

 

*Sorry for going too far off topic but this thread is already there*

Edited November 29, 2007 by Trev

[Rolla__Boy]

5 Grand for 400hp...is that rwhp or flywheel?

 

Put that 308 in a full weight HJ or something similar and it wont run a 12.

 

LJ's are not factory V8 cars, so does that mean I can chuck a V8 in my corolla and run a 12 and claim it's a great time for a standard V8?

[Jono]

 

 

I will put my N/A bigport against any engine here :lol:

 

 

 

only coz you have one of these shiny things...

[LittleRedSpirit]

If no-ones gonna help Emerson then I may have to close this one boys. Enough about 308s ok, back to beloved 4as. Any more wisdom to share that might make his decision easier?

[toyocharged]

From my own real world experience with a BT 20v. My engine is a wrecker engine, the comps range from 170-155( they should be round 190, the motor is tired). I have Autronic smc ems, ebay extractors and ebay trumpets. It made 185 flywheel hp on the engine dyno. Shift point is 8800, rev limit 9100, it has done probably 200 laps round mallala in practice and race conditions. It has been driven flat out for all those laps, you couldnt punish the motor that much on the street, trust me., if you think you can you are kidding yourselves

The engine tuner( Allan Engineering in S.A at Mallala) was amazed at the hp and the torque although not huge the curve is nice and flat. When the motor finally goes bang I will rebuild it with decent arp bolts some nice cams and a little headwork, more comp, aiming for a little over 200hp with said mods. the motor doesnt breathe at all and runs like a clock. I hear all these stories about how the 20v's are crap.

Internet talk is cheap :lol:

[LittleRedSpirit]

From my own real world experience with a BT 20v. My engine is a wrecker engine, the comps range from 170-155( they should be round 190, the motor is tired). I have Autronic smc ems, ebay extractors and ebay trumpets. It made 185 flywheel hp on the engine dyno. Shift point is 8800, rev limit 9100, it has done probably 200 laps round mallala in practice and race conditions. It has been driven flat out for all those laps, you couldnt punish the motor that much on the street, trust me., if you think you can you are kidding yourselves

The engine tuner( Allan Engineering in S.A at Mallala) was amazed at the hp and the torque although not huge the curve is nice and flat. When the motor finally goes bang I will rebuild it with decent arp bolts some nice cams and a little headwork, more comp, aiming for a little over 200hp with said mods. the motor doesnt breathe at all and runs like a clock. I hear all these stories about how the 20v's are crap.

Internet talk is cheap :lol:

 

Compared to most engines, 4ages are quite sound and made to take a bit of a beating straight out of the box, in whatever form they take. Keep fresh oil in em and get good tuning and they will go hard for years. Its very comforting for me to hear your experiences toyocharged, and backs up the way my ae111 engine has responded to what i've been doing, and my rev limiter is only a mild 8000rpm. You wont get a poorly designed motor whichever one you purchase.

[Rollaboy2608]

Personally I feel from my own experience, that a 20V blacktop is the perfect choice for a conversion, and for the following reasons:

chances are that any 20V you pull from a half cut will have less km's, and could POSSIBLY be fresher

 

if treated to a service and replacement of consumable parts(incl. clutch) it will go very well in standard form, I did a conversion on a AE92 once to blacktop, the guy was tight as, and wouldnt change the clutch, when finished it went terribly. Once convinced to change the clutch, it went really hard, much harder than the 100KW 4AGE in my AE93.

 

Any conversion you do is going to cost money, probably twice what you have budgeted. At the end of the day, you can bolt in a ten year old or so engine, and it probably will do what you want it to for another ten years, or you can bolt in a 20 year old engine, which wont rev as hard, probably wont go as hard(in standard form),and may not last as long as you would hope.

[Trev]

5 Grand for 400hp...is that rwhp or flywheel?

 

Put that 308 in a full weight HJ or something similar and it wont run a 12.

 

LJ's are not factory V8 cars, so does that mean I can chuck a V8 in my corolla and run a 12 and claim it's a great time for a standard V8?

 

Over 400 @ the fly, It weighs 1200 or something odd kilo's oh and this car is capable of an 11 with this engine but traction was a probem on the 12.2 and when the 12.5's were run the car had taller tyres so the gearing was also taller, Acceleration & MPH were down, It was also just driven off the line with no stallup.

 

So you never heard of the LJ XU-1 serII V8 that they released 3 of from the factory but road authorities said they were too dangerous cause of the power to weight ratio so they canned production and made them production cars, Do what you want, You wanna open the engine up and measure the bores and stroke too?

 

only coz you have one of these shiny things...

 

Yeah thats why.

 

If no-ones gonna help Emerson then I may have to close this one boys. Enough about 308s ok, back to beloved 4as. Any more wisdom to share that might make his decision easier?

 

Sorry Matt, Had too, No more from me tho.

Edited November 30, 2007 by Trev

[ae174agze]

i surpose it all comes down to the money you want to spend ahahah 4age, silver top, 4agze or black top

[toyocharged]

I will put my N/A bigport against any engine here :P

 

When ever your ready Trev :jamie: